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Art Discussion Interview Series, art prints, artist, Freud family, Jane Mcadam Freud, limited edition fine art prints, lucian freud, sculptor, sculpture, sigmund freud

Art Success: Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Jane McAdam Freud

2nd December 2012/by Studio Damoah

Art Discussion Interview Series, cibachrome, cibachrome printing, fine art photographer, fine art photography, photographers, Ruud van Empel

Art Success. Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Ruud van Empel

29th October 2012/by Studio Damoah

Art Discussion Interview Series, art prints, artist, Freud family, Jane Mcadam Freud, limited edition fine art prints, lucian freud, sculptor, sculpture, sigmund freud

Art Success: Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Jane McAdam Freud

2nd December 2012/by Studio Damoah

Art Discussion Interview Series, cibachrome, cibachrome printing, fine art photographer, fine art photography, photographers, Ruud van Empel

Art Success. Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Ruud van Empel

29th October 2012/by Studio Damoah

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Art Discussion Interview Series, art prints, artist, Freud family, Jane Mcadam Freud, limited edition fine art prints, lucian freud, sculptor, sculpture, sigmund freud

Art Success: Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Jane McAdam Freud

Jane McAdam Freud is an internationally acclaimed, multi award winning British visual artist. Born in 1958, her work includes sculpture, installation, drawing, prints and digital media. McAdam Freud studied at the Wimbledon College of Art, Central St Martins and the Royal College of Art in London. Impressively, her work started to gain recognition from the very early age of 18, after the launch of her first solo show. Following the exhibition, one of her award winning pieces was acquired by the British museum. In 1986, she went on to win the, the British Art Medal Scholarship in Rome.

A highly accomplished artist, McAdam Freud has work in private and public collections collections including the National Gallery in London, the Victoria and Albert Museum in London, the British Museum and the Greek National Gallery among other international museums. Other awards she has won include the Italian State Mint prize in 1991 and Freedom of the City of London in 1992. Despite her many achievements, McAdam Freud remains humble and unaware of what many others would see as a very successful career to date.

Daughter of one of the most widely known British painters in modern history- Lucian Freud, McAdam Freud kindly took time out of her busy schedule to express her thoughts on her career to date, her fathers influence, success and patriarchy in art.

Dad Head Sculpture, 2012, stoneware fired terracotta

Adelaide Damoah (AD): I read that you first discovered your passion for art at the age of three while playing in a sand pit! Is this a real memory, which, you can actually recall, or is this something your parents told you about when you got older?

Jane McAdam Freud (JMF): It is a real memory of when I discovered my passion for the tactile, the power of the sensory and the joy of getting my hands dirty: in short my first sculptural experience. This is not something I could articulate at the time but more of a powerful sensory experience held deep within. I think it is like that with driving memories; they power one and are channelled through a resonant force within. In the case of the sandpit I avoided replicating the experience literally as I don’t want to lose the magic and power of the memory.

AD: I get the sense that you have a real passion for what you do and that the desire to do it is intense and real. When do you first recall having the desire to become an artist?

JMF: As far back as I can remember, with a complete overriding passion. I have always thought that it was the only thing to do and the thought inhabited every fibre of my being. My mother did painting and then fashion at St. Martins. Both parents being artists I thought that this was what everyone did so it was something concrete and possible in that regard. Many of my parents family friends were artists too, so I understood early that you had to strive for the best, work hard and seriously or else! I picked up on the fact that there was a difference between taking your art seriously, valuing, documenting and archiving it as opposed to just doing it.

AD: Is it possible to distinguish whether or not that desire had something to do with your father?

JMF : The intensity of the feeling may have had something to do with my father as his intensity in general and especially for his work was something I experienced form so young, from birth: he was there at my birth. This level of intensity for life, for what one does is something I have always felt.

AD: Can you pin point how and why he influenced you to pursue an artistic career?

JMF: Not sure about pinpointing but when you live with such intensity and passion as part of your identity, whether it be from an external parent or an internal source, the two get mixed up, or put another way it becomes internalised, an influence in that way, an instruction somehow. I can remember wanting success as an artist with a passion from so very young. It was my secret wish with every pull of the wishbone. I wished for it so badly believing the harder I wished and worked, or put another way -dreamed and drew, the more likely it would come true. I thought then that success meant having work acquired for a public collection – or having work on show in a public gallery.

I looked at the catalogues my father left lying around our house all the time and became entranced with the figures, their haunting eyes and how they filled the picture plane. How the figures were composed rather than the paintings being compositions. I was then very shy, my mother, a loner herself was quiet, and my father didn’t speak much so it was through images that I formed my views and from which I took my impressions.

Dad drawing, 2012, pencil on paper

AD: You went to the Wimbledon College of Art, Central St Martins and the Royal College of Art. What courses did you study at those three colleges?

JMF: I did a Foundation Course at Wimbledon College of Art, where I studied a bit of everything.

At Central St. Martins I studied the same course in the same rooms as my father. Strangely it was a course I felt driven to do without reason, although I consider it to have been the best initial training I could have wished for. The course was called 3D design / Jewellery and it was that I learnt all the sorts of skills that I needed to make things, albeit on a small scale. It was designing for objects on the body; the way we designed ,they bore little resemblance to what is conventionally viewed as jewellery in a commercial sense.

I was intrigued to learn that the Northern European Court painters like Hans Holbein the Younger and Quentin Metsys founder of the Antwerp School initially studied metalwork and jewellery design. Interestingly they were also both the sons of painters themselves. Perhaps there was some sort of unconscious instruction going on there. When I applied to the Central I had no idea at that time that my father had also enrolled on the same course when he was seventeen. It was my paternal grandmother who first enlightened me. I was surprised as I thought my father had wanted to be a painter from the outset but in fact he was also initially drawn to the 3D course at the Central but never finished the course. When I asked him about it he told me that sculpture was actually his first love and he tried different things before he came to painting. Anyway I love these sorts of what I call trans- generational links. Sometimes I play with the idea that I finished the course on my father’s behalf on some sort of unconscious level.

While I was at the Central I learnt that my prowess was with carving and modelling. The highlight was designing and making a medal to commemorate the Centenary of Picasso’s birth in 1881, which the British Museum immediately acquired for their permanent collection. What I loved about Picasso was that he traversed so many media, from painting to pottery and sculpture.

I love having a multi-disciplinary approach as this approach simulates life and ideas. Ideas come in many forms and the freer you are to respond the closer you are to finding an expression for the idea. At the Royal College of Art I took a Masters Degree by Project, where I wrote my own project and nominated the departments I required to access. I called my project: Forms of Relief – the Post Modern Medal. My supervisors were John Stezeker – Fine Art Department and Edwardo Paolozzi from Sculpture and Ceramics. I think it was the first multi disciplinary degree they had there. It does not suit me to be pigeon holed and I think cross-overs by default create originality. I was also doing some teaching at the RCA during that period, so I was crossing over from being a student to being a tutor.

AD: You won the British Art Medal Scholarship in Rome in 1986 and went on to study sculpture. Was it a conscious decision to study something other than painting- different from your father?

JMF: When I was on Foundation at Wimbledon, I realised it would be ridiculous for me to study painting and try for an unachievable goal i.e. to make a mark in the field where I would have barely a chance of equalling my father. I wanted to do something for me, about how I experienced the world that rang true to me. Sculpture, informed by that first sandpit experience seemed to be where I should be heading and that is where things led.

Earthstone Tryptich, 2012, stoneware fired terracotta

AD: Your most recent exhibitions, Family Matter, Flesh and Stone and Three Generations all seem to relate somehow to your family. I am especially interested in the way you contextualise the use of the word matter in the title of the show Family Matter. Could you give me a bit of background on each show? Could you also expand on the meaning of your title for “Family Matter”?

JMF: Family Matters was the exact title but yes it referenced ‘matter’. The exhibition was at Gazelli Art House gallery in Mayfair. This is the gallery that represents me in London. As I had been working with my father’s image making sketches, photo collages, and sculptures during that year, this is what I wanted to show. Death of a parent is a highly personal experience and in that way the title applies, i.e. It is a family matter. However, also the effect that a parent’s death, however estranged, has on you- does matter. I work mainly with process and materials so ‘matter’ the stuff from which I work and the stuff from which we are made together created a pairing that captured my imagination and helped me get through the mourning.

Flesh and Stone was the title of my show in York at the New School House Gallery. They selected some of the works from the Mayfair show along with a newer series of works called Animen and Huminals. My output for this show again referenced in part my father’s image and in a post life way it was also meant as commemorative and so I wanted to it to recall that he was interested in depicting flesh. As many of my portraits of him were made in terracotta clay and were stoneware fired it evoked images of turning flesh to stone, making it live on, so Flesh and Stone with its biblical connotations I thought was an apt title.

Three Generations was the title that the curator of Whitelabs Gallery wanted. Whitelabs is the gallery that represents me in Milan. We decided to show the drawings I had made at the Freud Museum alongside some of my sculptures from the series called “After Bacon.” Three Generations references Sigmund through the drawings I made of Sigmund Freud’s collection of antiquities. It references Lucian – through Bacons influence on him as I see it through these sculptures and also through some photo collage images I made combining my face with my father’s face.

I am looking forward to showing my new works, which come from a different place. As they are in progress I don’t like to talk about them as it takes some of the driving power away from the process.

AD: I read that you centre much of your work around psychoanalysis, which is especially interesting because of your great grandfather Sigmund. Could you explain a little about how you do this and why please?

JMF: I am interested in the driving forces beneath the radar rather than the rationalised. My work comes out of and is informed by the unconscious forces in myself and the resonant collective unconscious forces that edge their way into the works, in the way the conduit mechanism works for many artists. I am informed by my use of materials in the same way.

It is the way I see the world, through a psychoanalytic lens. I am pretty analytical. I don’t like to judge or come down on either side but rather to analyse ‘why’ things might be (in context with other considerations and time, place etc) –to illuminate to throw another light on something seemingly fixed (which nothing is). This may be an inherited or conditioned approach? I do this instinctively and it creates the imagery to express how I feel about the world and life. Not sure how clear this is but this driven approach is difficult to capture in words.

On completion of a work I tend to interrogate the ideas and contexts with a psychological slant examining these aspects as though the work itself were up for analysis! When a work is finished I live with it for a while and see what it suggests in terms of further associations, which may have gone unseen, or unknown while the piece was conceived.

Sometimes a work may come out of asking a question of a material or process and looking deeply at that question and its ironies and associated questions.

AD: Have you studied psychoanalysis at all?

JMF: I studied psychology as part of my first degree – as an option in the compulsory ‘liberal studies’ part of my course. I have read a lot of psychology though as part of my research for my work and as a personal interest.

AD: I understand that until you were in your thirties, you were known as Jane McAdam. The art world was not aware that you were the daughter of Lucian Freud and you had achieved a significant amount before the news got out. How long did it take after finishing your studies for you to become established as a full time artist?

JMF: When I was still a first degree art student at the Central the British Museum bought a piece of my work so this was a leap forward as it were into the Museum world. When I finished at the Central, the British Museum commissioned an edition of my Picasso Medal for a collecting society they initiated called The British Art Medal Society. This led to commissions and it all sort of took off, with one thing leading to another. As my studios got larger and the works got more ambitious the pace hotted up and in the last 5 years it has spiralled.

Picasso Medal. 1979. Bronze. 100mm approx

AD: What challenges did you face along the way and how did you overcome them?

JMF: I was patient and worked all the time. If I had challenges along the way I can’t easily remember the detail of what they were. Being a positive person I have probably successfully blocked them out.

What I do know is that the challenges were in the region of ‘letting myself’ do this or that. Not editing out the guts and not censoring myself in the way I tended to in the first half of my life. Life starts at 50 in this regard. When I was 50 I decided my life had begun – (50 being half of 100 and I often say, part jokingly that I will be very angry if I don’t live to 100). This decision corresponds with my predilection for pairing, which has been in my work in one way or another from the beginning. I thought the pairing of the first half and the second half of my life was a symbol of a work. Life is a work. The first 50 years I hadn’t claimed it I feel and now I try to. It is always easier to defer to the other; a part of empathy I suppose but it isn’t helpful to the self or the art.

AD: The art establishment in this country is known to be particularly patriarchal. As an accomplished female artist, have you encountered any resistance to your progression as an artist because of the fact that you are female? If so, what specifically and how did you over come it?

JMF: I left all those male dominated societies (won’t mention any here through fear of a patriarchal punch on the nose). Men in art are generally fine but it is the one or two territorial types who can be really indignant that women are on what they claim as their patch (particularly in sculpture) and can make life difficult. What I have found is that it is best to move out of the way and towards more of who you are and what is uniquely yours. I like Theodore Zeldon’s approach, which is that the ‘brave run away.’ Perhaps that’s why I veered more towards ‘family matters’. Perhaps it was a sort of retreat back into the bosom as it were or perhaps a move towards who I am – what makes my work more me and therefore uniquely mine.

Down to Earth Installation 1, Boundaries exhibition, Paddington Studio, 2011, salt and grit

AD: You have achieved significant accolades in your career to date and clearly been “validated,” so to speak by the art establishment. What in your opinion does it take for a female artist to be validated by the art establishment?

JMF: I think it is a man’s world (unfortunately for us) but if you are doing something all your own and men are not interested in being on that territory then they leave you alone. It is pertinent to your question that I do speak increasingly about this divide through my current works.

AD: With all of the shows and other achievements under your belt, what is your personal definition of success in art?

JMF: Oh dear, not sure if one ever feels successful. My goal posts move at each achievement. If I did feel that I had arrived at success my work might ‘go off’ as it were. You need to be willing yourself to do your very best at each turn.

Down to Earth Installation 2, Boundaries exhibition, Paddington Studio, 2011, stoneware

AD: What has been the biggest set back in your career to date?

JMF: I try not to see things as setbacks but just opportunities to do things differently. I love the example Edison used when asked how he felt about failing to make a light bulb 10,000 times. “I have not failed 10,000 times. I have successfully found 10,000 ways that will not work.”

AD: What has been your biggest achievement to date and what steps or process did you go through to achieve that?

JMF: My solo show at the great Gazelli Art House gallery in Mayfair, next door to the arts club. The strange thing is I didn’t do anything to achieve this as the director found my work online and asked to come to my studio. Strange really as I sometimes work so hard to achieve far less and it doesn’t seem to happen.

Down to Earth Installation 2, Boundaries exhibition, Paddington Studio, 2011, stoneware

AD: At this stage of your career, what is your ultimate ambition or dream for your work?

JMF: To get a piece into the Tate, Tate Modern or National/National Portrait Gallery has been a grand ambition since early childhood. Although this has been partly achieved it is never in the way you envisage. One of my works was shown at the Tate Modern just as it opened, in a show of London (local to Southwark) artists works. Also the National Gallery archives have a piece of my work. I dream of having a show at such a venue one day!

AD: What advice would you give to a young artist wishing to follow in your footsteps?

JMF: Be true to yourself and maintain integrity. Don’t let yourself be put off by rejection. See it as a challenge to placing your work in the right context. Avoid putting your creative energy into resolving conflict. Instead move out of the firing line and just get on with your work. Keep your overheads low so that you can make art your priority. Don’t be afraid of investing in yourself as if you don’t no one else will!

Jane McAdam Freud. Photo by by Jens Marott

AD: Do you have any new projects or shows coming up where people can see your work or hear you speak?

JMF: On now until December 14th 2012

‘Set’, (Archive Exhibition pairing student work with current practice). Lethaby Gallery, Central St. Martins

http://www.csm.arts.ac.uk/museum-study-collection/exhibitions/

13th & 14th March 2013

Something Special Art Exhibition and Auction, Blackall Studios, Leonard Street, Shoreditch on , see info and video

http://www.jossparkessearchlight.org.uk/

4th, 5th August 2013, Co-Chair of Discussion Panel on Art Life of Sigmund Freud, Symposium on Psychological Birth and Infant Development, Freuds Birthplace, Pribor, Czech Republic.

https://freudsymposium.eventbrite.com/#

11 January – 1 March 2013 Solo show, Gazelli Art House, Baku, Azerbyjian

Spring 2013 (Dates to be confirmed), Exhibition, Pushkin Museum of Fine Art, Moscow

May 15th – 18th 2014, Delivering Paper and Chairing a panel on Art/Object for the The 6th International Symposium, Psychoanalysis and Art, Florence.

Jane McAdam Freuds official website.

2nd December 2012/by Studio Damoah

Art Discussion Interview Series, cibachrome, cibachrome printing, fine art photographer, fine art photography, photographers, Ruud van Empel

Art Success. Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Ruud van Empel

I came across Ruud van Empel’s work on Facebook because someone posted one of his stunning images from the eponymous “World” series. I was dumb struck. I instantly fell in love with his work and was astonished that I had not heard of him previously. Born in 1958 in Breda, the Netherlands, Ruud van Empel studied graphic design at the Academie St. Joost, Breda between 1976 and 1981. After some time working in the field of graphic design, film, television and interior design, van Empel purchased his first Apple Mac and began to learn about the wonders of Photoshop. This was a turning point and van Empel went on to pursue a successful career as a fine art photographer, despite much advice to the contrary. Utilizing a complex technique of photo montage van Empel produces stunningly beautiful, yet strange and captivating images. His work has been exhibited globally and exists in many private collections, including the art collection of superstar Elton John. Ruud van Empel was kind enough to take time out of his hectic schedule to discuss his career and his views on success in the field of fine art.

Adelaide Damoah (AD): I read that you studied fine art at the Academy of Fine Arts Sint Joost Breda between 1976-1981. Why did you decide to study graphic design?

Ruud Van Empel (RVE): I was advised to because I used to make comic books when I was a kid. The process involved lettering and design for the covers so it made sense. In addition, a number of people advised me not to go into art because I was told that it did not give you much of a future in terms of making money. That was wrong in a way. Anyway, graphic design was also nice, especially when I studied in the 1970’s. It was a really interesting time in the world of art and design. There were many things happening, so it was very interesting to study that. After graduation, I had to work in graphic design studios. That was too boring for me! I did that for about half a year I think. Then I just stopped and started making art. I started to do painting and videos in the early eighties. I experimented with that. I also did some set design. I did all of the things that I did not study to find my way, while having an interesting job and making some money. I was not particularly commercial as I accepted jobs because they were interesting for me. I did set-design for a number of theatre plays and television shows. Slowly, I started to get involved in movies. I did art direction and the production design of a movie here in the Netherlands. In fact, I worked on a very nice movie which 20 years later, is still very popular here in the Netherlands.

AD: What is it called?

RVE: I can not translate it into English, but essentially, the two main characters are a couple who act like children. They have very big teeth and look funny, it is a comedy. It was hilarious and very campy. This was done in 1989. The collaboration between the two actors and I was successful because we really understood each other. We went on to do a couple of television shows. There is a channel here in the Netherlands and they do some experimental television. We did a nice show on there. Translated, it was called “Creative with corks.” It was the kind of show that taught you how to make creative things out of corks. It was a comedy. That kind of work was very interesting and exciting to do for a while. I did it for about five years. I finally decided to only make art because it was all too limited. By the time I stopped television, it was in the mid nineties. By that time, everything became very commercial. This meant that the artistic starting point was losing ground and things became commercial. I wanted to work for more artistic programmes. All of the artistic programmes were discontinued so I made a decision to stop there and and carefully start with art.

AD: What was the process of transitioning from that to art.

RVE: In 1994, I bought my first Apple Macintosh. It was a Power Mac at that time. A lot of things were possible because of that, it was very interesting. I started out with a series called “The Office.” Those were ideas that I had previously for set designs and the Apple Macintosh allowed me to make them in Photoshop. It did not cost any money. I could build as big and as nice as I liked and it became an art piece instead of a real set. In reality, I could never make those kind of sets because it was too experimental, too expensive and there was no time, but in Photoshop, I could do it! It got completely out of hand. I started working more and more. After working for about three years in Photoshop, I presented it to a gallery in Amsterdam and they liked it immediately. I got an exhibition there, and then I got one in Germany and in France. Suddenly, I had a big success with that work. That is how it started.

AD: That was your very first series, the Office?

RVE: Yes

AD: Did you teach yourself how to manipulate images in this way?

RVE: Yes, just by doing it. Somebody taught me how to work with it- all of the basic things you can do with the programme. Then after that you just have to start working. You discover all of the possibilities when you are working. That was very inspiring for me. I was working 10 hours a day every day! I did not get out of my house much! It was a good thing to buy a computer and start working in that way.

AD: I read that your first official solo show was the one in 1999 at the Groninger Museum, under the title “Waterpas of Optisch recht?” (Level or Optically straight?).

RVE: The title of that show was made up by those actors that I worked with before. It was kind of a joke that when you hang things like paintings on the wall, there are two ways of doing it to make sure that it is straight.. When you do it by eye, this way is optical right. But if you do it by measuring, it is more precise. I used to work on the sets that I did for those two actors. One of them heard me repeating those lines and that is how we came up with the title.

AD: What did that work involve?

RVE: It involved a lot of poster design. The first photo works were shown there.

AD: Did you sell any work?

RVE: The museum bought two works at that time. I just had a big show with them last year. In 1999, they decided they wanted to do a big show with me in the future and that happened last year.

AD: I read that your international breakthrough came in 2005 with the series entitled “World Moon Venus,” at the “Picturing Eden” exhibition. What was that exhibition all about?

RVE: That show was curated by Deborah Klochko. She is a curator from New York. She saw my work on the internet and I think later on, she saw it here in 2004. She just sent me an email asking if I wanted to participate in that exhibition, just like that. That is the good thing about the internet and email- everyone can contact you very quickly. She wanted me to be in her exhibition she was doing about Eden.. The image of Eden and how that is depicted in works today. This was in 2005. We were in the middle of George W Bush times and America was not very popular. It was a country that was kicked out of the Garden of Eden, just like the bible story where Adam and Eve were kicked out of the garden of Eden for doing wrong… That was her feeling. All kinds of contemporary artists were invited. She thought my work would fit well with the show and she put my work on the cover of the catalogue. Immediately, I got a lot of attention. At the same time, my gallery was showing some of my work in Miami and we sold about 35 pieces of work in four days.

AD:Wow!

RVE: Picturing Eden was in January 2006. I also had my first solo show in a gallery in New York in January 2006, so that all came together at that point. I was working on the “World” series. World, Moon, Venus.. I became internationally successful at that point.

AD: Would you agree that 2005 was your breakthrough?

RVE: Yes, I would agree, that is when my name got known world wide and the work was selling very fast. Prices were getting higher. Elton John saw my work and bought it. All those things happened at once. It can go very fast.

AD: How did you depict Eden in that show?

RVE: There were a couple of the “World” images, like World Number 1. The image was of a black girl in a white dress. This was very popular and it worked very well for the black community in the USA, because they were not used to having a black person depicted in such a positive way in fine art.

AD: Yes and this is part of what excites me about your work. They are depicted in a stunningly beautiful and positive way. What inspired you to focus on dark skinned black children as subjects in your work?

RVE: At that point in that series, I decided I wanted to do something with beauty. It also comes from my technique that I was developing at that point. You have to find a way to make things look beautiful, because if you start to montage photos in an experimental way, you find that the sizes of things do not fit relative to each other. If you start to do that, things start to become very ugly. In a photo, things have a two dimensional feeling. This applies to the faces, because the faces are montaged completely. The eyes, the eyebrows, the mouth, even the pupils. All of those things are montaged, so the montage is very detailed and I have to be very careful that things are right, that they look as if they could be real. I am therefore very focused on making it beautiful, or not ugly, because it becomes ugly when it is not correct. If the mouth is just a little bit too big, you see it and feel it immediately and it becomes ugly. If you look at the series that I did- “Studies for Women,” you will see that I was still developing my technique. The technique was not perfected yet. You can see that the images of the women are kind of frightening. I did not make the montage perfect. I was very aware that I must make it as perfect as possible and that means that it must be beautiful. This is important to me, I don’t want to make an ugly image. Beauty is important to me and it is one of the things that still impresses me. I am 52 years old now and lots of things that I used to find interesting 20 years ago, I don’t find interesting any more. But beauty is something that always stays.. I chose children because innocence is also a kind of beauty as a subject, so those two things together make the world series. The nice thing about the World number one also is- I did not know this at that point- an art historian said that black children had never been the subject of innocence before in this way. This was the first time in art history. It was nice. I was surprised. But before I did “World Number 1,” I made an image of a white girl in a white dress with pigtails standing in a birch forest. I was criticised for that picture because she looked so incredibly white. People said that it reminded them of the Nazi era- that she was so white that she must be an Arian. I was not thinking about that at all. I was very surprised that people made that connection.

Untitled #1. Copyright Ruud van Empel.

AD: I would not make that connection at all. I am looking at the image now and it is a very beautiful image.

RVE: At that point, I became aware that people are very sensitive to what they see. They can make all kinds of connections to things. If they saw a girl with pigtails, they connected it to the second world war. This was kind of crazy to me. From that, I started “World” and I made the girl black. I wanted to see how that would look. I put her in a white dress and that is how “World” started.

AD: Congratulations. It is a beautiful series. That is what drew my attention to your work. I also read and saw a clip of the Dutch television documentary, “Beyond Innocence.” How did that come about?

RVE: The exhibition that I got in the Groninger Museum was decided already ten years before hand, but not confirmed. It was confirmed in 2007, so lots of things were happening at that point in my life. Both of my parents died for instance. My brother, who is a professional documentary film maker and camera man, spoke to me and I said maybe we could film a documentary… Maybe we could film a video at the exhibition. But my brother was kind of ambitious and he talked to the television network here in the Netherlands and they decided that they wanted to co produce this documentary. There is a channel in the Netherlands where they make art documentaries. They said it could be one of those films. That is how it started.

Beyond Innocence DVD

AD: How was it received?

RVE: It was very well received and people were very excited.

AD: I can imagine because just watching the short clip on your website, it looked very good.

RVE: It took three years to film. One day, I heard that Elton John was coming to the Netherlands for a concert. I asked his photography manager- I have contacts to her because he bought my work. I said I wanted to interview him for four minutes for the film. They agreed to ask him, but said they were not sure if he would do it. He ended up giving us twenty five minutes! It was a big surprise and was a very nice interview. He normally refuses interviews but he did not refuse me. At the end of the interview he said, “I had a very nice day! Yesterday, I met Andreas Gursky and today, I met you!” It was really exciting. Later on, I went to see his show and he sang a song for me!

AD: Wow!

RVE: Yes! At the beginning of our film.

AD: You have done lots of exhibitions and Elton John collects your work, you have also won lots of prizes, including the Charlotte Kohler Prize in 1993. What does success in the art world mean to you?

RVE: The last prize sort of involved my art work as the prizes were given for all of the work that I did- including television work, set design, graphic design, interior design and art work. They gave me the prize for all of that together. That is important when you are young especially, to get prizes, to give you a push. To bring you to the attention of other people. For example, the Charlotte Kohler Prize was for artists up to the age of 34 I think… The Werkman prize, is for mid career artists- like early forties. I actually won the Werkman prize on the same day as 9/11. The attack was announced as they were about to give me the prize. There was a lot of confusion and they did not know what to do. They quickly gave me the prize, there were no photos and every one went home. This meant that I got no publicity or attention for my work. The attacks were so terrible that of course all of the attention went there. That was a pity.

AD: What would you say were some of the biggest challenges that you have had to face as an artist?

RVE: Getting a good gallery was very difficult, especially here in the Netherlands. It is a small country so, there are not so many possibilities. I was very firm in what I wanted. I wanted to be treated honestly by the galleries. I was very firm in my agreements with them. The moment they did not stick to their agreement, I was out of there. That was the hardest thing for me- to get honest, good and fair treatment from galleries.

AD: How do you personally define success in the art world at this point in your career.

RVE: If I am able to have exhibitions in museums and public places where people can go and see it, that to me is success. That is the best thing to have. To be able to show your work. They give you exhibitions because they like and are interested in your work. That is the best part of success I think. For the other part, in terms of the commercial side, if your work is selling well enough, you can live from that. Of course, that is very comfortable and nice. I have that situation so I am very happy with that.

AD: I would take it that from your definition, you would consider yourself successful?

RVE: Yes. I am not working for success. I am just working for my work. My work develops and I like to make work. That is why I do it. People like Damien Hirst I think have been working with all kinds of publicity stunts, I don’t know exactly how that works, but anyway, he got really big using a strategy. That is another way of achieving success I think. If you get a lot of attention put on you then automatically things will happen and people will be drawn to your work. That is not the kind of success that I am after. I just want to be able to work as an artist for as long as possible… To make work. I hope that I will be able to show it in galleries and museums. That is what I am aiming for. If that works then I am successful.

Venus #5. Copyright Ruud van Empel

AD: There is this notion that has been propagated throughout history of the starving artist. Has that ever been your experience?

RVE: That is a myth, the starving artist. Actually that myth has caused a lot of problems here in the Netherlands. Because of this myth that Rembrandt and Vincent Van Gogh died for, they have started sponsoring art here in the Netherlands. The problem with that is that certain people decide which artists get sponsored and which artists do not. From there, all of the problems start. I am one of those artists from the Netherlands that was not being sponsored in his early career, so it was more difficult for me to build a career. The myth about poor artists- well Rembrandt was not poor, he just could not handle money. The same goes for Vincent Van Gogh. He got a certain amount of money from his brother each month. It was so much that a family of eight people could live from that. For him, it was not enough, because he was spending constantly. That was the problem. For artists- you have to work hard if you want to get your name out there and be noticed. It does not come easily. The whole idea of an artist sitting in his studio in the attic or basement on the floor is something from 200 years ago! It does not work like that any more. Now you have the internet, you can have a website, you can do all kinds of things to get your work noticed. There is a whole market nowadays, there are a lot of people interested in art and buying art. It is therefore possible to have a career in art. It was not like that in the 1920’s or 30’s. There are well known stories. People like Magritte or Man Ray. They had been poor for most of their lives and when they were old, in their 70’s, the art market started developing, mostly in the United States. They went there and sold work and finally made some money for the rest of their lives. But those days are over. It has all changed now.

AD: What would you say was the ultimate dream for your work?

RVE: My big dream… That the work gets better and better. I am getting more critical of course. As I do more work, it becomes more difficult for me to make work that satisfies my own wishes. If the work gets better in future, that would be the ultimate dream.

AD: What advice would you have for aspiring artists wishing to follow in your footsteps?

RVE: To follow your heart always. To work hard and to know know your goals. One has to know what one wants. For example, this gallery or that museum, to make this series of work. Don’t let yourself be distracted and follow your heart. Following your heart is what will make you feel good in the end. Like I said before, everyone advised me not to go into art. If I had followed that advice, I would be a poor, frustrated and unhappy man today! In the beginning, everyone said that my first work was not art. They said it was ridiculous. I got very negative reviews. Everyone hated it! But I just kept going because that is what I wanted. You must have belief that you can do it.

AD: Do you have any new projects or shows coming up?

RVE: Yes. I have my first show at the MOPA- the photographic museum of San Diego. The director of that museum is Deborah Klochko. She became head of that museum. That show will then travel through the United States. That is the first museum exhibition coming up. Next year, I have one in Antwerp, Belgium, one in Stockholm, Sweden and in September 2012, I have an exhibition of new works at Flatland gallery here in Amsterdam.

Ruud van Empel

Ruud van Empel has been represented by Flatland Gallery in Amsterdam since 2005 and is also represented by Stux Gallery New York.

29th October 2012/by Studio Damoah

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Art Success. Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Ruud van Empel

Art Success: Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Jane McAdam Freud

Art Success. Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Ruud van Empel

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Art Success: Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Jane McAdam Freud

Art Success. Adelaide Damoah in Conversation with Ruud van Empel

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